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2:28 pm
September 5, 2011
OfflineI am making the Caerphilly Cheese from the recipes and I have put my mesophillic culture and calcium chloride and rennett in and have waiting the 40 minutes, but it's not making a clean break so I have let it set another 30 mins. How long can it sit like this at 90 degrees? Also, what did I do wrong? Thanks for all your help.
3:14 pm
November 11, 2010
OfflineDid you let it ripen for 30 minutes after you added the meso culture or did you add the culture and rennet all at once? It can sit for a while at that temp. I had that problem once with queso fresco and after about 2 hours, it did break. I don't know what else to suggest other than going back and reading the directions to see if maybe you did something in the wrong order. Have you made it successfully before this time?
4:00 pm
June 13, 2010
OfflineI'm having the same issue. I made Queso Fresco today…It sat for like 90 minutes before I got the clean break and I'm just sure I followed the instructions 100%…but I did run into a couple/few questions while doing this….(I used raw, unpastuerized milk)
1. how long can it sit while I wait for a clean break? I was worried that with the extra setting time it would spoil. It sounds like from above that I might be okay.
Was I supposed to wait 30 minutes between the starter and the rennet? The Book (Ricki's Home Cheesemaking) didn't indicate that so I didn't. (Also, I'm using a liquid rennet that I bought at an amish grocery – I'm not sure if it works as well as new englands, next time I'm going there, but I can't let this go to waste.
2. When it says to let it sit for 30-45 minutes until curd breaks, that's with the heat on or off? I did it with the heat off and the lid on.
3. After cutting, when reheating the curds it said it was supposed to take 20 minutes. I had my stove on the lowest heat setting and it only took like 15…Was that okay?
4. When is said to add the salt and maintain at 95 for 30 minutes, I actually had to leave the heat off and it cooled to 95. (I even checked with three thermometers.) I did notice it looks like the bottom of the pan I use has an insulated bottom. at least it's got about a 1/4 inch thick "foot" on the bottom and I wonder if that holds in some of the heat…It stayed between 100 and 95 the whole time slowly cooling back to 95.
Do you think this is going to be safe to eat, or should I pitch it? I want to do what's safe.
Doggone it, I may not be a milk maker by the time I get done with this. I have one more packet of meso starter and then I have to decide if I should get more…I've struggled with the clean break thing on everythign I do…mozz and this…I keep thinking eventually I'll get it. I get about 8 gallons of milk at a time and keep practicing when I get it, but it's just not great. (Fortunately I don't have to pay for the milk I get – that would make the whole experience totally cost prohibiative.)
5:25 pm
October 31, 2010
OfflineHere are some tips:
You may not get a curd due to your milk being too hot. Once the milk reaches target temp (90 for queso fresco), you need to remove it from your heat source and sit it somewhere else. A liquid like milk retains heat for a long time. With a mesophillic culture, it will kill the culture if it gets too warm so temperature is important. Be sure to use your thermometer and remove it from any heat source right away while the culture and rennet is working.
[Just a note here - direct heat on the stove is really not the best way to make cheese as it is very difficult to control the temperature. You should use a "double boiler" type set-up in which your pot w/milk is setting inside a larger container with water in it. It is easiest to accomplish by setting your pot of milk in the sink and either running hot tap water into it the sink to bring the temperature or if your tap water isn't hot enough, keep a kettle or pot of water hot on your stove to add to the water in your sink when it gets cooled down. As the water in the sink cools, drain it out and start with new hot water.]
Be sure to test your thermometer to be sure it is reading correctly. The ones from NEC are callibrate-able with the screw nut. If you use the thermometer with the 12" stem, the pack it came in gives directions on how to calibrate. If your temp is too hot OR too cold, your rennet won't set up as it should.
Ricki Carrol's recipe doesn't state the wait time but most other recipes do. There are many errors and things just plain left out of her recipes in the book which make the book a little frustrating for someone with no experience. The wait time allows the culture to begin working and start producing the lactic acid that you need to get the break you're looking for.
Miss do-mess…. are you using raw or pasteurized milk? That will also make a difference. I'm answering these questions as if RAW milk. Let me know if pasteurized and I'll write a bit more on that issue.
2. After adding the rennet, you want that pot off the heat source. (As stated above, if you leave it on the heat source, the temperature WILL creep up and will cause several problems including "killing" the culture as mesophillic is not for high temperatures.) It is okay if the temp. drops a degree or 2 during this period of time. Don't be alarmed if that happens. Usually it will stay within a degree as the liquid keeps heat very well.
3. It is very important to bring the temperature up no more than 2 degrees in a 5 min. period. I find it much easier to control that by setting my cheese pot into the sink that I have run hot water into. If the temperature is raising too quickly, simply pull the pot up onto the counter and lkeep it out of the water for a bit.
The reason for slowly bringing the temp up is that if it is too quick, the curdes "seal" – they get a skin on them – that keeps the whey from escaping. You want the curds to continue to release whey during this time or it will not release whey properly while pressing, usually causing a "sour" cheese and other problems. It is better not to get quite to temperature than to get there too quickly.
As far as your 15 min., sometimes they don't seal and sometimes they do. Depends on the specific batch and just how quickly things were moving. You'll just have to try it and see how it presses.
5. You mentioned the temperatures of between 100 and 95 in the pot while it was resting after salting. If it was at all above 95 you are going to have problems with this cheese in the press. As soon as you have brought brought it up to 95 during the "cooking" time, you need to remove it from the heat. Again, the pot will retain enough heat to keep things where they need to be. If you had it on heat during that waiting period I can almost guarantee that they got too hot, again sealing the curd in that situation.
So, the procedure is: once you have drained the whey and are putting the pot back to sit at the target temp, DO NOT RETURN IT TO A STOVE or hot heat source. You could set the pot into a sink in which there is warm water – about 95 degrees at this point – and let it rest. Or, not in the sink at all. The pot will keep things close enough to temp. Again, in this stage, if it loses a little heat it is better than getting hotter.
All that being said, when I've had a queso fresco (or other cheese) not turn out so well, we've never had to throw one away. When I haven't liked the end flavor, we've just grated it and used it for lasagna, pizza, etc., like you would use mozzerella. I just used those early trials as the opportunity to learn and continued to work out the bugs on the next batches until I got pretty consistent at it!
One trick I learned is that if you let your queso fresco "age" in your regular cold fridge for a week before eating it actually developes a better flavor. I put mine into a glass container with a tight fitting lid (like the pyrex storage bowls) and don't cut it until a week down the road. During that week I turn it over morning and evening just like I would if I were doing an aged cheese so that it ripens evenly.
And…don't give up!!!! The more you work with cheesemaking, the more you get the "feel" of things and understand what's going on in the process, it will all make better sense to you and you'll have some great cheeses for your effort!
5:38 pm
March 15, 2010
OfflineI made cheese today too…mozzarella..& it didn't turn out right either, kinda hard & glossy…almost transparent. I've made it successfully a few times before, but I the last time I made it..earlier in the summer..it was a failure also. I am keeping a journal of what kinds of milk I use (store bought) & what proceedure I use each time.
I love making cheese…it's just magical. Sometime I hope to advance to hard cheeses.
6:15 pm
June 13, 2010
OfflineLeah's mom thank you…I use raw milk so your instructions are good. I am getting two more gallons tomorrow, so I'm going to try again.
As for the book, I will admit I have been less than happy with it. It seems like it's written for beginners, but you are right, little things seem to be missing now that I've tried a couple of things in it. I have another one and I tend to use them side by side (like when I make mozz), but the other one didn't have the queso fresco in it so it was me and the book on this one. I'm going to master this and mozz before I move to anything hard.
I can't fit my cheese pot into anything else, So I will start having a sink of hot water on reserve and a pot of boiled water…I think I'll go to that after the first temp is hit. I was trying to do it slowly and moving it on and off the heat, but I still think the stove is too hot.
The cheese is pressing now and it seems to be losing a pretty good amount of whey even after three hours, so maybe I got lucky and the curds didn't seal. I kept going even after I felt like I was goofing up because I figured I'd learn from it if nothing else. and I have so thank you for that. I'll try this brick next Saturday and hopefully it will be okay.
I won't give up, I'm sure – I was just super frustrated and feeling like I was never going to be any good in the kitchen…so I decided to do something else new and made my first ever, real true pie crust and I think it did good. So today had one small success. Not cheese related, but I'll take them where I can get them!
Hence the "mess" in the name!
11:06 pm
October 31, 2010
OfflineCheck out this web site for a queso fresco recipe that has very good instructions. Molly's recipes tend to be very well-written with helpful instructions to clarify things.
http://www.fiascofarm.com/dair…..fresco.htm
The recipe is written for goat milk but has the temperatures in parenthesis for cow milk right beside it. I use her recipe as a basic start for queso fresco and made a few modifications but for the most part it is the one I use. I could send you my modifications when I get some time (really busy for the next couple days).
1:50 am
October 31, 2010
Offline2:29 am
October 31, 2010
OfflineBanjobetsy said:
I am making the Caerphilly Cheese from the recipes and I have put my mesophillic culture and calcium chloride and rennett in and have waiting the 40 minutes, but it's not making a clean break so I have let it set another 30 mins. How long can it sit like this at 90 degrees? Also, what did I do wrong? Thanks for all your help.
For the slow curd formation, the same things apply in whatever cheese you're making so be sure to check that your thermometer is calibrated and you're using correct temps.
There can be a WIDE RANGE in flocculation times (initial thicking of the milk) depending on conditions of your milk such as the season of the year/time in lactation cycle of the milk source, feed being used, rennet strength, etc. Usually the seasonal differences aren't huge if you're getting your milk from a larger flock, but if it's from just 1 or 2 cows, it can be pretty marked. If antibiotics are being used, that can also cause problems.
The times stated in most recipes are really just "typical" times that are based on, and assume, a flocculation time (initial thickening) of around 10 minutes. Often it is a bit longer or shorter depending on the conditions stated above, so it's not a problem if it takes a bit longer than stated in the recipe.
It could be something as simple as needing to get new rennet (be sure to store liquid rennet in the fridge to keep it fresh fresh and useable for the longest period of time). [Just a note here - the "supermarket" rennet - Junkett - is a weaker rennet and is not designed for cheesemaking. Not sure what rennet you're using but thought it was worth mentioning just in case.]
Hope that's helpful! 
4:22 pm
September 5, 2011
OfflineThanks everyone for the help. It did finally get a "clean" break after more than 1 hour, WHEW. I had it in a water bath for heating…I didn't calibrate my NEC thermometer before because I forgot how to do it
….but it looks like it came out okay. IT TASTES WONDERFUL!
Now I have it out to dry for a couple of days and then I am going to wax it and get my mini-fridge to the right termperature….and I should be good to go..
Great to have such support! Thanks again.
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